Why aren’t we sailing more???

[JayZ]

Responding to your comment below;   Absolutlely! 

This is something that the PHRF committee has discussed numerous times.  There is a PHRF boat of the year but the format needs a lot of work and to have a more structured format.

Speaking of behalf of the PHRF Galveston Bay I believe the committee could help to support this notion of a Galveston Bay Champion.

Here's a thought that I'd like y'all to ponder: Should we not have a Galveston Bay Championship? Not yet another event but crowning the right boat as the Galveston Bay Champion at the end of the year. A boat that has participated in a predefined set of regattas which includes the three clubs that put on bay regattas and outperformed the rest (not as easily defined as you might think!). Think about it: Would this not provide an incentive to participate in a wider set of regattas? We could define this as a small set (e.g., Performance Cup, Leukemia Cup, Shoe Regatta) or any combination of larger sets, maybe mixing weekend regattas with fixed mark ones. In the end we'll have a (rotating?) event attended by all that celebrates the champs. That would pull the bay together and generate some excitement!

[Hamburger]

The first thing I'm getting out of this discussion is that nobody is recommending to eliminate any regattas! Really? Where is all that 'too many regattas' talk now?

Regarding the issue of the Bay Champion: I'm aware of the PHRF Championship, although that's a pretty well kept secret. As long as you only count boats that sail in PHRF classes towards that championship you're excluding many if not most of the serious racers on the bay. That's why I said the scoring isn't as easy as you might think. But if you designate a set of regattas as being part of the championship series you could probably get the respective race managements to take finish times (and of course course lengths) for the OD classes, as well, and dual score the OD boats as PHRF. Somebody with more experience in this than I have should come up with some proposed method to make that happen!

[Bee]

I think the "talkers" here are mostly hard core racers and not the so called "cruisers."  Stinger signs up for everything, but that's because I thought I would be gone by now.  Not surprised that the discussion is tilted toward keeping all the races.

At to the Bay Championship or the PHRF Championship , I always thought that since the 105's race on the order of 8 or 9 OD races each year they were essentially excluded from winning the PHRF Championship .  Certainly they would have difficulty keeping up with the rest of the PHRF fleet because those OD races would not be counted in the final total. Never actually gave it much thought.  Still seems like a good idea to me so I really don't have a problem with it. It never occurred to me that Stinger would ever even come close to the PHRF Championship . Needless to say, I was pleasantly surprised to learn that Stinger was the second place boat in it for 2015.  I guess that shows you what signing up for everything does for you.  You can do good even when you (me) are not.

Mathematically it wouldn't be difficult to figure out who won what in PHRF.  The formulas are pretty simple, but as you know, racing under OD rules changes the amount of cloth one has aloft and that can change the OD boat's rating.  The 105's with class sails rate 87 while those like Stinger with full PHRF sails rate 78.  Removing that difference would have to be accomplished by changing each 105's rating to 87 for OD races.  I suppose this could be handled by the RC in each case but my guess is some folk would take issue with the change.  I don't see how to get around that.

The first thing I'm getting out of this discussion is that nobody is recommending to eliminate any regattas! Really? Where is all that 'too many regattas' talk now?

Regarding the issue of the Bay Champion: I'm aware of the PHRF Championship, although that's a pretty well kept secret. As long as you only count boats that sail in PHRF classes towards that championship you're excluding many if not most of the serious racers on the bay. That's why I said the scoring isn't as easy as you might think. But if you designate a set of regattas as being part of the championship series you could probably get the respective race managements to take finish times (and of course course lengths) for the OD classes, as well, and dual score the OD boats as PHRF. Somebody with more experience in this than I have should come up with some proposed method to make that happen!

[Hamburger No 1]

The 109s have the same rating issue. Our PHRF rating is based on large sails, but in OD racing we use smaller ones, because that's what the class sails are. There are PHRF ratings for that configuration, I think, we just don't use them on GB. If we get a GB Championship going then we could allow OD boats to 'register' for the Championship series with the small configuration PHRF rating. That would allow proper OD racing and still dual rating for the championship. Just talking here. All this could be easily managed with a bit of creativity and good will.

[Bee]

I am aware that the 109s have a similar issue.  However, good will is what I think the missing issue is.  In the paste, if you had a PHRF rating certificate then that was your rating period.  Changing it meant you were at least trying to take advantage.

The 109s have the same rating issue. Our PHRF rating is based on large sails, but in OD racing we use smaller ones, because that's what the class sails are. There are PHRF ratings for that configuration, I think, we just don't use them on GB. If we get a GB Championship going then we could allow OD boats to 'register' for the Championship series with the small configuration PHRF rating. That would allow proper OD racing and still dual rating for the championship. Just talking here. All this could be easily managed with a bit of creativity and good will.

[hayesrigging]

If the class min number of boats was raised to 5 the OD issue would be a non factor for the most part.  Another suggestion would be for two regattas a year dedicate them as PHRF champ races and for those two regattas everyone races PHRF with OD sub classes.  Most people have agreed that 3-4 boat OD classes are not fun or competitive for the most part. 

[Hamburger No 1]

Right, except we should have at least three events to make up the GB Champion, one from each club. How about Performance Cup, Shoe Regatta, Leukemia Cup? These are the signature two-day regattas of the various clubs. How many PHRF classes? Just one? Spin/nonspin? More than that?

[Jeff K]

When I was given the great job of tracking the PHRF boat of the year scoring three years ago, I saw that it was really just a participation award. I was also told, that was the intent but I didn't like that answer. So I actually spent a decent amount of time taking the results of six major regattas on the bay and comparing them to the participation award winners. I mean no disrespect to the previous phrf boat of the year winners because I'm one of them. My idea was to take the winners (w/l spin & non-spin, distance spin & non-spin) of those six regattas and have a 1 day phrf championship race off. Consisting of one distance race and one w/l race for the spin and non-spin classes. It would be sponsored by the phrf board along with a different club each year. You could easily add the one design winners and make it a Bay Championship.   

The idea was voted down because of some good arguments. Where are you going to stick another race day in at the end of the year, volunteers for RC, what if the guy with the most wins can't make that one day regatta and / or what if a guy with 6 regatta wins lost the race off to a guy with one regatta win?

Personally I like the idea of a Galveston Bay Championship Regatta but there would be some problems that would need to be worked out.

[marc]

When I was given the great job of tracking the PHRF boat of the year scoring three years ago, I saw that it was really just a participation award. I was also told, that was the intent but I didn't like that answer. So I actually spent a decent amount of time taking the results of six major regattas on the bay and comparing them to the participation award winners. I mean no disrespect to the previous phrf boat of the year winners because I'm one of them. My idea was to take the winners (w/l spin & non-spin, distance spin & non-spin) of those six regattas and have a 1 day phrf championship race off. Consisting of one distance race and one w/l race for the spin and non-spin classes. It would be sponsored by the phrf board along with a different club each year. You could easily add the one design winners and make it a Bay Championship.   

The idea was voted down because of some good arguments. Where are you going to stick another race day in at the end of the year, volunteers for RC, what if the guy with the most wins can't make that one day regatta and / or what if a guy with 6 regatta wins lost the race off to a guy with one regatta win?

Personally I like the idea of a Galveston Bay Championship Regatta but there would be some problems that would need to be worked out.

I like that idea. Do it the first weekend in December when the weather is still pretty nice (usually) and there's not much going on. I'll volunteer to organize the Race Committee (people, equipment and boats). The only change I would make to what you suggest is make it 2 days instead of one. A one day championship leaves no flexibility for a lack of wind. You would hate to crown a Bay Champion based on a 4 knot floater.

[Bee]

Yup.  Good idea.  Depending on the size of the classes, I have always thought rating the OD racers independently was a good idea. Too messy to handle the rating differences.

When I was given the great job of tracking the PHRF boat of the year scoring three years ago, I saw that it was really just a participation award. I was also told, that was the intent but I didn't like that answer. So I actually spent a decent amount of time taking the results of six major regattas on the bay and comparing them to the participation award winners. I mean no disrespect to the previous phrf boat of the year winners because I'm one of them. My idea was to take the winners (w/l spin & non-spin, distance spin & non-spin) of those six regattas and have a 1 day phrf championship race off. Consisting of one distance race and one w/l race for the spin and non-spin classes. It would be sponsored by the phrf board along with a different club each year. You could easily add the one design winners and make it a Bay Championship.   

The idea was voted down because of some good arguments. Where are you going to stick another race day in at the end of the year, volunteers for RC, what if the guy with the most wins can't make that one day regatta and / or what if a guy with 6 regatta wins lost the race off to a guy with one regatta win?

Personally I like the idea of a Galveston Bay Championship Regatta but there would be some problems that would need to be worked out.

[derklauer]

"The idea was voted down because of some good arguments. Where are you going to stick another race day in at the end of the year, volunteers for RC, what if the guy with the most wins can't make that one day regatta and or what if a guy with 6 regatta wins lost the race off to a guy with one regatta win?"

As a new member here is my perspective on this:

There are a lot of events.  There are pros and cons for both participants and organizers,  good luck finding that happy medium.  The same possibility of loosing to an underdog exists with in the MLB and NFL with the playoff Wildcard system.  I would have to say they are two fairly successfully sports who make it work.  As for participation in the final event, that's not something that the org should worry about managing, you either participate or you don't.  Set the date and if its important the boats that qualify will be on the line.  If the lead skipper (or any other individual) has a previous obligation that weekend well then...There are a lot of events. 

[Evan]

A little late but I don't get on here much. I will bite on this Al as I have been a supporter of eliminating excess regattas on the bay for quite a while...

In my opinion the way you increase participation is to decrease available options. Simple supply and demand. This means that each club needs to do some soul searching, quit hoarding, and let some weekends go.

I don't think the fixed mark races are part of this problem as they are all very popular and fall in line with many people's "one day" wishes. When it comes to multi-days, each club has their own niche as shown below...LYC is the king of offshore races, HYC is the king of two day weekend regattas, and GBCA takes care of the fun specialty racing. That being said, I think each of these clubs need to start dropping some (many) of these if they want to see increased numbers.

I'll take a shot at suggested multi-day keepers:
LYC: Shoe, Harvest Moon, J-Fest (on the fence on this one)
HYC: HOOD, Leukemia
GBCA: Conundrum, Singles/Divorce Cup
LYC/HYC/GBCA/TOMA/Whoever: The hardest to pull off, but some type of offshore extravaganza for extra credit

That is 8 weekends of fun covering the year. In other words, one a month when people actually want to spend time sailing. The rest of the winter woes and summer heat can be filled with GBCAs awesome rummies and Lakewood's Bay Cup (although the two race version of late seems to have lost the spirit of this race...).

Less races = less participation awards = more anticipation = more participation = fun with great people

There you go, fuel for the fire from someone who has frankly gotten bored with weekend GB racing because, well, no one shows up.

Cheers,
Evan

The talk about too many events has been going on for years. Incidentally, one of the biggest concerns not mentioned here is that it takes an army of volunteers to put on a good regatta and we're wearing out our volunteers the way we're going.

For the 2016 J/70 North American Championship at LYC in May we're trying something that is new in its breadth of application: The cadre of race officials will be a true representation of the best Galveston Bay has to offer: We're really excited to have representatives from all four Bay Area clubs (LYC, HYC, GBCA, TCYC) and the Sea Scouts on the water for this event. I see this as an example of how we could transform racing on the bay to build the 'bigger regattas' that y'all are talking about.

Fewer Regattas: Which one's should go away? Somebody speak out about that, and don't exclude your own club! I see several categories of events:

Weekend Bay Regattas, the staple of racing on the bay: HYC Midwinter, GBCA Performance Cup, HYC Elissa Regatta, LYC Shoe Regatta, HYC Leukemia Cup, HYC HOOD, LYC J/Fest, HYC Turkey Day

Offshore Regattas: LYC Heald Bank, HYC Offshore Regatta, LYC Emerald Coast, GBCA Texas Two-Step, LYC Harvest Moon

Fixed Marks Races: GBCA Icicle Series, GBCA Rum Race Series, LYC Bay Cup Series

Specialty Events: GBCA Conundrum, GBCA Singles, GBCA Doubles, GBCA Women's

I'm sure I missed some (e.g., TMCA?) events. Each category attracts its own set of participants and the vast majority of the regattas have significant history. Is that a reason to keep it? I don't now. Which ones should go away? Step up and say!

Here's a thought that I'd like y'all to ponder: Should we not have a Galveston Bay Championship? Not yet another event but crowning the right boat as the Galveston Bay Champion at the end of the year. A boat that has participated in a predefined set of regattas which includes the three clubs that put on bay regattas and outperformed the rest (not as easily defined as you might think!). Think about it: Would this not provide an incentive to participate in a wider set of regattas? We could define this as a small set (e.g., Performance Cup, Leukemia Cup, Shoe Regatta) or any combination of larger sets, maybe mixing weekend regattas with fixed mark ones. In the end we'll have a (rotating?) event attended by all that celebrates the champs. That would pull the bay together and generate some excitement!