My wife wants to sail the J24 to Galveston, spend the night at Harbor House and sail back to Seabrook the next day. This sounds fun to me and i do not want to miss a chance to get her out on the boat. We want to do this sometime this spring or early summer and the trip will be about sailing, a pleasant dinner, and relaxing at a decent hotel. If all goes well, my chances for a future sailboat vacation increase substantially.
The problem is, I know little about Galveston Bay outside HYC to Eagle Point, and Clear Lake for Wed. night racing. We just have the tiny two stroke motor, so I want to sail all the way and keep plenty of distance from the ships. It seems the best way would be to sail down east of the ship channel. The chart shows spoil banks on the east side of the channel, and on both sides further south. Do I need to find the channel through these spoil banks, or can you just sail across anywhere with a 4 foot draft? What about the Redfish bar? All we will have is a Tactick compass and hand held vhf radio, so we will pick a good weather window, if Sailflow can give me two days of nice wind.
I have a lot of racing experience, but the only navigation I know is looking for the windward or leeward marks. Actually. I can follow channel markers and even took a ride on the Bolivar ferry to get a first hand look at that busy intersection. Any suggestions will be appreciated.
Barry
The east side of the ship channel is a nice route to Galveston if you have time. I did it many times in our old Santana 35 that drew 7'. Just put a small jib up and do a couple of tacks to kinda stay in the middle, you won't have any trouble at all. I do recommend taking an extra gas can with you, just because...
Handheld GPS is also a good iead ;D
With a J24, the Seabrook/Galveston trip is a lot more fun (and less effort) if you can pick a weather window that lets you reach or at least fetch the 20-miles of the ship channel both ways. It's a long, long ride with a 3.5hp Nissan and a 1.2kt adverse current. Since the channel runs mostly SSE-NNW, a nice NE is good for the run down, and a SW for the run home, but that combination doesn't happen often on a single weekend. The usual thing is SE both days, so you get a lopsided beat down and a broad-reach back.
Get into the channel well-north of Redfish Island, do *not* route between there and San Leon Point. You might make it in a J24 at very high tide, but there's been a lot of boats pulled off of Todd's Dump Reef. If the tide is more than a foot or so low, use the South Boaters Cut (it's marked in the charts near #61) to cross or enter the channel.
If your weather window sucks, and you have to short-tack the channel, one option is to exit into East Bay at the Trinity Channel (the bend at #51). There's been some debris reported there, but at 4ft draft you'll be out of the worst of the current and won't have to dodge traffic. Stay at least a half-mile away from the backside of Bolivar and its ferry landing, that gets shallow.
Speaking of traffic, on a J24, ya don't have a lot of speed, so plan *waaayyy* ahead on the shipping ... You're much much better off run-ground than ground-up. Even where there's spoil banks along the main channel, there's usually 12-20ft of water on the outside of the marker. Don't hesitate to use that, the ships won't go there.
The junction of the ship channel with the intracoastal is always bigger than than it looked on the map. Get there during daylight if ya can, from #26 to #20 there's lots of deep water, traffic, and lights. Stay clear of the Galveston ferry docks, and from there it's a couple of miles to Harbor House.
Call ahead to make sure they've got dock space, all their floating stuff was pulled up to dredge a couple of weeks ago. Try the calimari appetizer at Willie-G's, very highly recommended.
I'd also recommend a hand-held GPS, with the local chart updates. It won't cost ya more than a night at Harbor House, and you get to keep more than the memory.
Have fun!
G4B
- J24#3224
Plan B might be a nice afternoon sail out to a new place called Judges Bar and Grill (http://www.facebook.com/pages/San-Leon-TX/Judges-Bar-and-Grill/143810613358?v=wall&viewas=762738446%3Cbr%20/%3E113%206th%20St.%20San%20Leon,%20TX,%2077535) in sunny San Leon.
I know J24 Mutinous Dogs was able to sail into the San Leon Marina (in full pirate regalia) during 'Talk Like a Pirate Day' at the Buccaneer Bar a few years back. Sadly, the Buccaneer Bar got wiped out during Ike.
When I drove by the same place last week, the former "World's Ugliest Marina" appears to have been fully cleaned up after the storm.
Judges (with new docks) was built across the parking lot from where the Buccaneer used to be.
I haven't heard of anyone actually trying to sail into the San Lean Marina post Ike, or if any additional dredging that might have taken place, but 'in theory' it's a doable J24 lunch date that would make for a nice afternoon sail.
Old pic (http://marinas.com/view/marina/4078_San_Leon_Marina_TX) of the San Leon Marina before the storm (bonus points if you can pick out the J24 in the picture)
Thank you for the info. Now I just need to find the perfect weather.
The J24 is Wiki-Wiki II, sitting on her trailer at Jim (Hollywood) Sherriff's place. She survived Ike okay, picked up a few new scrapes. They had about 3ft of water into Radio City, but were serving cold beer the next day. I dunno how much draft Judge's Docks can handle, most of the nearby shore and bulkheads looked like they'd collected a foot or more of sand. Maybe somebody can call Judges to check? ...
And then there's the story about trying to get home from Buccaneer-Bar, having run down there in a 20kt northerly, and the water dropping a critical foot while we were having dinner ... *L* ...
Yanno, it is sort of a shame that there really aren't any upper-bay places for a keelboat to day-trip from Kemah for lunch, other than up to HYC. That Tex-Mex bar up by the Hartmann bridge hadn't re-opened, the last time I checked a couple-three months ago.
G4B
Barry/baileyrace ...
... What I meant to add, earlier: Don't forget to check the channel current as part of your weather window. There can be a knot or so of tidal effect that's with-ya or agin-ya in the channel. Heavy rains and strong northers can boost that to a couple of knots ebbing, and sustained lows or southerlies can push an extra knot or more of flood. When you're making 4-6kts in J24, that much current can giveth or taketh away a lot of speed-over-ground. It's about a 30-nm trip, not including any tacking, so allow plenty of time.
G4B
Thanks G4B,
I did guess that the j24 was on that trailer. I had not thought about current until it was mentioned in an earlier post. I am starting to question whether this is the trip to introduce my wife (and myself) to cruising. It is a long time on the water at 4 or 5 knots.
I'm not sure what "work" they're doing at Harbor House, but word is that they've been reposesed/foreclosed and are now out of business. Can anyone else confirm?
I don't know anything about getting a shallower draft boat down to Galveston for an overnight, but if you crew on one of the boats doing the Heald, HYC Triangle or other offshore you'll get a free look at what it's like doing the ride up and down the channel (not to mention an offshore race to boot..;0)
So, being the official shill of the discussion forum I say, head over to the crew finder area and post your interest in crewing offshore. ;D
I hadn't heard that about Harbor House, BJ ...
... We had dinner at Willie G's about 3-wks ago, they'd completely remodeled, said they were back in business a couple of months after Ike. The floating dock components were piled up on the pier, and it was the WG-manager who told us they'd started work on the outside of the waterfront bulkheads, but were waiting on a skinny dredge that could fit into the little harbor. Maybe there's more to the story? ...
Barry/bailey ...
... I've made the J24 round-trip to Galveston four (maybe five?) times, and I think the shortest dock-to-dock was just over 3-hrs. That was a spinnaker run all the way up the channel in 12-15 kts of breeze with maybe 1kt of favorable current, and a surfing-genoa reach from Redfish back to Seabrook. All the other rides were more like 4-6 hrs in 8-12 kts breeze give or take. The tricky thing about taking a 'cruising passenger' on a J24 is that the ride tends to get fast and get damp at about the same time. That said, lizbiz and I have been pondering making that trip for a while too, putting the boat at GYC and staying seaside somewhere.
For other cruisable GB destinations, you might check out Remedy Ed's site:
http://www.remedyandcrew.com/
http://www.remedyandcrew.com/Destinations/destinations.html
I don't know how many of those places survived Ike, but Ed has updated since then. His boat draws about 5ft, so you should be able to J24 them. The entrance to Double Bayou is sorta tricky, but doable. For Topwater, plan to arrive before noon, then wait for the seabreeze to sail home. I haven't visited the other places.
G4B
Kevin, izzat a hint or what? ... *L* ...
...
I think you may be referring to Harborwalk, near Dickinson and off the ICW, west of the Causeway Bridge that is undergoing financial problems. Harbor House is solvent!
--- Andy Howard
Quote from: BJSailor on February 24, 2010, 08:49:51 PM
I'm not sure what "work" they're doing at Harbor House, but word is that they've been reposesed/foreclosed and are now out of business. Can anyone else confirm?
Thanks for the clarity Andy. Glad Harbor House is still up and running.
Harbor House, Harbor Walk, Harbor View, Harbor Schmarber... Hard to keep 'em straight!
Speaking of places to go has anyone heard anything more from the woman that wanted input on building a marina or anchorage over in Chambers County? I think she was from the Chambers County Economic Development Foundation.
Further to Harbor House being open, dredging is complete and should be open for business. Below is link to the HH webcam ---- http://www.galveston.com/cruisecam/ .
Quote from: ChrisK on February 23, 2010, 02:49:38 PM
Plan B might be a nice afternoon sail out to a new place called Judges Bar and Grill (http://www.facebook.com/pages/San-Leon-TX/Judges-Bar-and-Grill/143810613358?v=wall&viewas=762738446%3Cbr%20/%3E113%206th%20St.%20San%20Leon,%20TX,%2077535) in sunny San Leon...
...Old pic (http://marinas.com/view/marina/4078_San_Leon_Marina_TX) of the San Leon Marina before the storm (bonus points if you can pick out the J24 in the picture)
Here's a new pic I took on Sunday of Judges and harbor...I tried to get the same angle. Eagle Point is in the background, open but still pretty banged up.
When you look at the Old pic link (http://marinas.com/view/marina/4078_San_Leon_Marina_TX), it makes for an interesting 'before and after' picture.
Buccaner Bar is gone but J24 Wiki-Wiki II is still there, hatches open, in need of some serious love.
Yo will really have to watch the tides and it ripes on an incoming tide after a big low tide. The chanel is narrow and a lot of ship traffic so tacking back and forth in that chanel is hard to say the least and the wind on the way down is generally on the nose. So just watch the tides and go on a falling tide and come home on the flood.
Would it be safer to cross over into East Galv. Bay (Trinity Bay?) and stay away from the ship channel until near Bolivar? Would this be too far?
My wife is questioning her desire to sail for 5-6 hours. She is all for it at 4 hours. I fear that too long on the water, especially on a plush comfortable J24 will ruin her enthusiasm for future sailing.
Again, thanks for all the advice.
Also, thanks to everyone who has mentioned tides, as that is something I have never paid a lot of attention to other than trying to get through our channel into the bay or Clear Lake.
Is it most important to have the favorable tides where the bay narrows nearing Galveston?
It's probably best to time your arrival at Bolivar Roads for a slack-ish tide. There can be 2+kts of flood or ebb, and that can complicate things if the wind gets light. Trinity Bay is good option south of marker 51, if the wind or current aren't favorable.
Here's a couple of links, to NOAA's site, the overall site and GalvBay currents.
The menu is Products:Operational Forecast System: Galveston Bay Operational Forecast System,
then pick on the wind or current nowcast or forecast in the GBOFS page.
http://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/index.shtml
http://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/ofs/gbofs/fore_bay_cur.shtml
With regard to 4+hrs on J24 ... We left the dock at 0840, motor-sailed upwind to the BayCup start by 1000, finished 16mi race at 1320, goofed around on the return, and were back at the marina at about 1530 ... It does make for a relatively long day on a relatively small boat ... And it's just a sorta good/bad thing about J24s, you can sail casually at 4kts, but at 6+kts they need more attention ... *L* ... So, a slower, longer ride might be more relaxing overall ...
(And if ya need ... ummm ... 'facilities' for the trip, I've got one in the trailer-box, on the left side, feel free to borrow it, you'll need the blue-stuff ... )
G4B ...
I would suggest you motor sail your J24 to Galveston without the wife, have her meet you down there and do the sail back. If the usual SE wind holds, it makes for a very fast, pleasant sail under spinnaker back home. The trip down is the least fun of the two. If she likes the one way ride, then try for the round-trip. But if she hates the sail down, you may never get her back for the nice part of the trip and then you are screwed forever.
That pic Kelley posted looks promising. With that marina cleared out, you can actually tack inside the harbor, plus just from the water color it looks like they may have dredged the place out. The last time we took Mutinous Dogs in there (I think about 4 years ago) was spur of the moment (translation: drunk and unplanned) and a cold front came through, literally while we were at the bar. We then tried to beat out that channel straight into a 25-30 knot northerly, conveniently, the same direction as the channel. The channel was no more than 35 feet wide and on a good day only offered 4 feet of depth in the very center. This was not a good day. I think we tacked about 7 or 8 times to make half a boat-length to weather. Between the headwind, lack of room to tack, let alone build any speed and rapidly dropping water level we never stood a chance. In hind sight, if there was enough water, we probably would've just been tought a brutal lesson about lee shores. In the end we stuck the keel in the mud along a dock and came back three days later to get her out.
I could write a book on the ill-advised voyages of my $1000 J24 called Mutinous Dogs.
Marc
That's actually a really good idea marc.
I would add that it would be good to take a friend with you on the way to G-town. An extra set of hands helps. Plus your friend can drive wife's car home from Galveston....
Hug the side of the channel along the way (remember to look behind you, on occasion), leave room to bail out (ie. be ready to quickly set a sail) if you happen to be under motor and it acts up
Marc,
I would read that book of ill-advised Mutinous Dog Voyages, but feel free to change my name - was that story from the time we drank $1 margaritta's till sunset?
good times.
Lucy
Is that where you guys pawned my outboard to fund those 1 dollar margaritas and then told me someone stole it?
Heh ... I was the guy cranking the jib-sheet on all those 1.5 boat-length tacks, it might have taken the first 7 or 8 to figure out that we were mostly aground. As a saving grace, every time the boat wasn't heeled, it wasn't going downwind either.
... Maybe somebody should remind Marc why we had to sail, even thought we had a motor? ... Something about that 1/8" dia super-light weight-saving dockline getting into the prop, after more $1 margaritas than even I could keep count of? ... *L* ... It all seems rather hilarious in retrospect ...
Seriously, though, I think that's a good suggestion Chris made about sailing/motorsailing the boat down, and a spare pair of hands is always good (I've only soloed that trip once). Just make sure you've got a usual weather pattern settled in for the return trip.
... And Jeff, I'm sure the motor made it back, I just don't recall seeing the prop again. There was about 50ft of blue nylon spooled on the shaft, and no prop underneath when we got it unwound ...
Write the book, Marc ... *L* ..
G4B
With regard to picking favorable weather-windows for the sailing the ship-channel ...
... We had the basic idea correct this weekend (May 8/9th); having NE-ish breeze for the trip to Galveston that clocks to SE-ish for the return to Seabrook is a good overall plan.
... A couple of fine-points, though ...
... It's probably better to start a bit earlier in the day than 6pm(ish), and closer to the beginning of the the weather window. That way you don't wind up beating out to South Cut, making a dozen hitch-tacks to stay on the weather side of the commercial traffic in the upper end of the channel, and a couple of more hitches while traversing the HSC-TCC-ICW junction. It might also be nice to have some, umm, more obvious landmarks and maybe a larger choice of eateries, if arriving before moonset (although O-Malley's worked out very nicely on the latter).
... There might be a fine line for a non-sailor, between having a pleasantly-brisk daysail back up the channel, and the sort of rudder-hum surfing prompts full-attention to J-24 helm. On the trip down, we dropped the genoa near the ICW, mostly to slow down a bit and improve leeward lookout; dock to dock about 4-1/2hrs. On the trip back, we never bothered with a headsail, and still only took about 3-1/2 hrs. Winds on Sat started NE, but went to ESE 8-12, gusts 18+ near the coast; on Sun SSE 12-ish at the coast, built to steady 15+ with 20kt gusts.
... So, for a 'relaxed' mode J-24 daysail home from Galveston, about 4-5hrs seems like the crossover between thrashing and cruising, if you're taking a non-sailor. The total run is about 22mi, so you'd need to make 5+kt SoG, figure at least 10kts breeze on a genoa-reach? I think y'all could have a fun ride, if you caught a good sea-breaze day later this summer.
G4B
Quote from: Grind4Beer on May 10, 2010, 12:06:35 PM
With regard to picking favorable weather-windows for the sailing the ship-channel ...
... We had the basic idea correct this weekend (May 8/9th); having NE-ish breeze for the trip to Galveston that clocks to SE-ish for the return to Seabrook is a good overall plan.
... A couple of fine-points, though ...
... It's probably better to start a bit earlier in the day than 6pm(ish), and closer to the beginning of the the weather window. That way you don't wind up beating out to South Cut, making a dozen hitch-tacks to stay on the weather side of the commercial traffic in the upper end of the channel, and a couple of more hitches while traversing the HSC-TCC-ICW junction. It might also be nice to have some, umm, more obvious landmarks and maybe a larger choice of eateries, if arriving before moonset (although O-Malley's worked out very nicely on the latter).
G4B
... a few fine points from Grinder's grinder...
Was it **only** a dozen tacks, Skipper??? And did we really need the genoa? And next time you want me on the foredeck in the dark to drop the jib.... could you arrange a bit lighter wind?
and, umm..er.. folks... Those lovely bright lights on starboard as you get to the channel are NOT a marina!! It's Seawolf Park!!
But other that that... when are we gonna do it again??
~L ::)