Need for protest committee

[Bee]

I have run many Icicle and Rum races over the years and I have seen my share of violations of the RRS and the no luffing rule.  However, generally these violations were handled in a corinthian spirit wherein the violator willing and automatically accepted his or her responsibility and withdrew from the race. 

Today I watch a first place boat foul the second place boat.  This foul was blatant. The starboard boat was forced to tack in order to avoid the port tack boat.  Had the starboard boat not changed direction there certainly would have been a collision.  I was confident that the violator would own-up to his error and withdraw from the race.  I should have known better. In some circumstances winning is more important then fairness.

Today the first place boat won only because he refused to admit his error.

I surmise that if we are going to adhere to the RRS, we definitely need a formal protest committee.  Sad but I cannot see any alternative.

[Bee]

BTW, I am not claiming that I have never violated the rules.  I am sure there are circumstances where I did and probably did not respond appropriately.  I am talking about the ability to protest anyone. Me included.

[Hamburger No 1]

I'm certainly happy to own up to being the other party. Im also in agreement that the crossing was very close. But it wasn't as 'blatant' to me as it was to you, Bee. I believe your response was 'nice crossing'. The message to us from that was that close is all it was. I get no pleasure out of winning at the expense of fairness, so I will withdraw from this race. But I do recommend for future situations that a well placed 'protest' would have been clearer. Not everybody's intentions are as sinister as you describe, Bee.

[Bee]

Sorry Al.  I guess it was the rum talking.  Rum makes one dumb.  In my case, I seem to have a lock on stupidity. Should not have used the word blatant. My apologies.  As you are aware, I do not like the word blatant very much myself.  I doubt if there is anyone on the Bay that thinks you are someone who takes the rules lightly or every does anything blatantly.  We all think of you as being top notch.

I was talking about what I saw relative to Hamburg/Pingo.  Stinger may not have been close enough to be an expert witness, but it did appear to be a foul.  From your explanation, I see that I was in error.

I was definitely irritated by the Hamburg/Stinger crossing and it definitely played a roll in what I said above. Even though Stinger did have to alter course a bit to avoid collision, she did not have to tack and probably only lost a foot or two in the exchange.  I did not yell protest and, consequently, would not have won in any protest room.  I think you still would have won the race had you dimply done a 360.  Hamburg is always sailed extremely well. I appreciate your withdrawal, but am sure you would still have finished ahead of Stinger.

I still believe we need a mechanism or process by which we could at least indicate a protest and resolve it.  Maybe just go through the standard process --- yell protest at the time and fly the flag --- but discuss the issue afterward one-on-one rather then in a protest room.  Everyone but me probably knows this already. Not even sure that will work with a stupid hot head like me  but its  worth a shot.  This grumpy old phart needs to get a life.

Thanks for your measured response.  It is appreciated.

[Jeff K]

It's actually two 360's, except on Wednesday nights...

[Bee]

My mistake.  Under J105 OD rules its two 360's only if the foul occurs at a mark.

[ShakenNotStirred]

The perception from another boat can be deceiving. For example, as we were motoring in from H in race 4, it appeared to me that Stinger jibed and crossed between us and #2 after the race ended at 1500. But apparently she finished in time because she was scored as 5th place.

[Bee]

Could be. Whatever is fine with me.

[Bee]

We all thought we finished just before the deadline, but have Bob change it if you like.

[Bee]

Stinger has withdrawn from Icicle 4.

[JayZ]

We all thought we finished just before the deadline, but have Bob change it if you like.

Were you running that Fancy IPHONE APP of yours?  ...that would tell you when you finished.  No?

[Bee]

Yeah, but don't care.  Walter is correct either way.

[Jeff K]

Bee, I did not know that about the 105 class rules, interesting!

It seems that would entice closer port / starboard crossings? Does it or about the same?

[ShakenNotStirred]

Jeff,
A lot of local regattas have been making use of the US Sailing prescriptions Appendix T for the last couple of years (but you probably know that!):

SECTION A
PENALTIES WHILE RACING
If Section A applies, rule T1 shall be included in the sailing
instructions.
T1 PENALTIES AT THE TIME OF THE INCIDENT
The first two sentences of rule 44.1 are changed to: 'A boat may take a
One-Turn Penalty when she may have broken a rule of Part 2 or rule 31
while racing. However, when she may have broken a rule of Part 2
while in the zone around a mark other than a starting mark, her penalty
shall be a Two-Turns Penalty.'

http://www.ussailing.org/wp-content/uploads/DARoot/Race%20Admin/Racing%20Rules/Documents/2013-2016.US.Sailing.Prescriptions.rev.06.24.14.pdf

[Bee]

Jeff.  As far as I can tell the one-turn penalty makes no difference.  It does tend to keep the racing a bit closer.